Email providers with own push notifications

[deleted]

ve3jlg I don't wish to and don't have time to run my own email server. I am premium Proton user but for the lack of notifications (as I said in my first post, without sandboxed Google Play), I am forced to run to Tutanota (thanks @[deleted]), which works great. I use Simple calendar pro (with local backup), so no Proton calendar. And I could use their VPN for free also (without secure core). So at the moment they are a bit of a letdown.

malatoi

Hello SgtSurehand an all the others here in the thread,

I've never used google servives at all and I don't need my device to show emails immediately. So I really don't have experiences with these settings.

But, just for my understanding and maybe as a proposal for you, why don't you use for example any emailprovider together with FairEmail (K9-Mail) and allow FairEmail to notice you when new emails arrive?
I have just tested it: I changed the settings in FairEmail and allowed it noticing me when new emails arrive. I sent an email from my desktop computer to my email account on my pixel and ~ three seconds later my pixel beeped. Is this different to push notifications? Where are the advantages?

malatoi

[deleted]

malatoi From what you are saying it is clear to me that you have NOT tried to set up your third party client with service like Protonmail or Tutanota, or you would have found out it simply does NOT work. Because of how they work, you have to use a dedicated native app to access them. And Tutanota seems to have their own push notifications implemented while Protonmail doesn't and it's unclear when it will (creators of one of the most respected privacy software bundles seem to be perfectly happy with using FCM or they would have done something about it by now).

csis01

malatoi FairEmail (K9-Mail)

Fairemail and k9mail are two very very different pieces of software.

malatoi

[deleted]

I know, that you can't run Tutanota or Protonmail in an email client. But in the title you wrote "Email providers with own push notifications", so I didn't know that you are focused on the two. And my post was on the one hand a proposal to try a solution without push notifications and on the other hand a question where the difference is between push notifications and the behaviour of p.e. FairEmail and p.e. Posteo (which is my combination).

[deleted]

posteo + k9mail

malatoi

csis01

Yes, you are right: I didn't mean that they are the same. I should have written FairEmail ( or K9-Mail). They are the two reliable email client apps I know and use or used. They both can handle account from every (?) provider (not Tutanota and Protonmail ;) ) and they can notice you, when new emails arrive.

malatoi

[deleted]

Thank you for replies, appreciate your input. Going with Tutanota for reasons mentioned here https://discuss.grapheneos.org/d/4669-email-providers-with-own-push-notifications/19
Solved for me

tango

[deleted]

Good choice Sgt! Their a really good company ran by proper privacy enthusiasts who own all their own servers, simple to use, fully transparent and responsive if you need to query anything.

thure

Even though it is already solved for SgtSurehand, i am pretty happy with mailbox.org and posteo.de. Both are payed services, but come without advertisement and privacy features. I use them with FairEmail and get notifications for incoming emails, but they work with K9-mail as well.

malatoi

I really would like to get an answer to my question: Is there a real difference between using push notifications and (in my example) FairEmail together with Posteo. In my experiment

I sent an email from my desktop computer to my email account on my pixel and ~ three seconds later my pixel beeped.

What's the point using push notifications? Is it that faster? Is it more reliable? Is it...?

I am really curious about it.

csis01

malatoi What a "push" notification means, is that the SERVER initiates a message to the CLIENT by utilizing an existing connection that was opened some time ago by the CLIENT.

IMAP, the protocol used to receive email, supports a persistent connection that the server will use to push messages to the client. Fairemail, using an IMAP connection to any server, will receive PUSH notifications.

To make that more explicitly clear; you ARE using push notifications.

malatoi

csis01

Thanks for the clarification! I allways thought, that the term "push notifications" is bound to Google or Meta (Facebook, Whatsapp, Instagram). So, in my understanding now, push notifications technically is a service of a company or project, which works in the background and notices you, when new messages arrive. And the app does not have to be switched on for this. Basically it's neutral and not mandatory harming privacy.
I just remembered, that I use Threema and they offer since severeal month (?) their own push notifications, called Threema Push.

csis01

malatoi It does require the receiving application to be running in some manner -- foreground service is the best way to accomplish this, otherwise there is (a) no open connection for the server to send notifications along, and (b) nothing there to receive it.

Fakebook uses g's connection for their messages. g calls their implementation of push message delivery "FCM" for something like firebase cloud messaging. It works the same way as anyone else's implementation. Their software runs on the device, maintains a connection to their server, and delivers messages on behalf of others, while allowing them to collect data on at least some aspects of the data being delivered.

evalda

I also use both posteo and mailbox.org with FairEmail and notifications work very well 🌷

Recently I was thinking about the security of FairEmail github account / dev keys tho... In case their systems are compromized, we are screwed. And they are obviously not a big company with large security budgets...

Apart from tutanota, does anyone knows a larger email service that has an app with notifications working without Play Services?

csis01

evalda Recently I was thinking about the security of FairEmail github account / dev keys tho... In case their systems are compromized, we are screwed.

Install from fdroid and you are protected by it using fdroid signing keys. But note that ALL software installed has the same risk with compromised signing keys.

evalda

csis01 Thanks for your reply. I won't trust F-Droid with any critical apps.

True it's the same problem for any app, however email client is a very sensitive application thus I am more concerned about an email client run by a small team vs a random app.

csis01

evalda That's an unfortunate position. Fdroid is the safest place to find software from unless you audit source and build yourself.

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