Cellular Carrier Discussion Thread

OpenSource-Ghost

Does AweSIM support 5G networks? I want to switch to it, but I also want fast reliable data. T-Mobile offers just that, but they aren't as private as Librem.

BTW, local cops (undisclosed location in USA) absolutely hate Google Fi. They don't tell me why exactly, but its difficult for them to perform live intercept of phone calls of Google Fi users and impersonate them.

rsm

OpenSource-Ghost My concern has less to do with state/governmental monitoring and more to do with privacy and tracking from large tech. I would assume that using Google Fi on graphene renders the purpose of Graphene somewhat meaningless, since all information that's protected on a device level is being disclosed on a network level.

[deleted]

How does something like AweSIM compare to regular prepaid SIM if you can acquire one without KYC?

MetropleX

rsm not at all using Graphene provides all the benefits and features as listed on the website regardless of carrier. GrapheneOS is a security first platform allowing you to control your privacy to an appropriate level as chosen by you.

Kenny33

rsm

The only solution I’ve found which is somewhat inelegant is mysudo. I hate that it requires play services to give you call notifications on graphene. Allegedly mysudo is working on another push solution but I’ll believe it when I see it.

But basically swap out prepaid SIM cards every month or two (use it only for data) and then you get a mysudo account with 9 numbers and unlimited calling. Utilize these numbers to compartmentalize as needed.

[deleted]

Kenny33 basically swap out prepaid SIM cards every month or two (use it only for data)

What is being achieved by swapping them out every other month if your phone is uniquely identified to your provider by both its IMEI and IMSI? The moment you insert a new SIM it you start broadcasting both of these to your carrier so all your SIM cards are for all intents and purposes permanently binded to that IMEI. I believe it's what they use to blacklist or track stolen devices.

Whatnoww

rsm Where does it say you can't run your own VPN? Isn't just that it routes your traffic initially to another place? AFAIK that doesn't prevent you from running your own. Also, it's closed source as opposed to what? The main draw is the IMSI switching, which no other carrier apparently does.

rsm

Whatnoww I think it was a reddit thread where someone complained that they couldn't use Proton VPN and the creator of PGPP replied and confirmed that's the case. PGPP effectively needs the tunnel that a VPN occupies in order to work effectively. Let me know if your experience has been different.

Closed source as opposed to FOSS.

rsm

Whatnoww As a follow-up to this, I tried using PGPP. Two things:

It doesn't allow you to use a VPN as I mentioned. This is actually stated on their website. In emailing directly with one of the creators, he is of the belief that the relay system they use is actually better than using a VPN because the information is not aggregated in a single place.
PGPP may provide an additional layer of privacy for a typical phone user, but it has some compatibility issues with GrapheneOS. Namely, use of multiple profiles (which is one of the best benefits of GrapheneOS). Because PGPP's "Relay" occupies the VPN tunnel on Android, it needs to be in each profile separately to work. But the app itself is not tied to any particular account, so from what I can tell you would need to install and pay for a separate subscription for each GrapheneOS profile.
In looking at PGPP's privacy policy, it's not great. It basically reads like a privacy policy from every major tech company there is. That is, it states they have a strong commitment to privacy and only collect the information they deem "necessary", but then they use broad statements to justify what "necessary" means. From what I can tell, they collect just as much information as any other carrier or tech company, and you'd have to take them at their word for what they do with it.

Best bet is probably to just try the Librem aweSIM and then use a VPN instead. It likely gives you the same level of privacy at a fundamental level but with a more transparent and reputable name.

Kryptos

[deleted] Because, if I understand correctly, the prepaid SIM card they suggest isn't tied to your identity. I think you can pay in cash, buying them on EBay or brick-and-mortar stores.

mommy

[deleted]

Very interesting thread. I've gotten interested in this strictly for hobby sake from watching Niomi Brockwell haha, kinda like a game to see what its all about. I still Don't understand the part of someone changing sims monthly if the IMEI an IMSI instantly links you from the old sim to the new sim anonymously or not. Whats the advantage from a month to month lets say Mint mobile compared to their 12 month anonymous sim. Also I've heard of apps that would change the IMEI, before the sim swap, this wouldn't work in G-OS?

Kenny33

Kryptos

Exactly correct. The phone is purchased with cash locally so no tie and the sim can be purchased locally with cash as well

[deleted]

Kenny33 Exactly correct. The phone is purchased with cash locally so no tie and the sim can be purchased locally with cash as well

Even so, one can't remain anonymous for long. But more importantly and I don't know about you, but I use my phone to do regular person things. Even if I had purchased it with cash (I haven't), my IMEI would become tied to me within a couple days in more ways than one. I have stopped being bothered by it. I keep my phone in Airplane mode 90% of the time and mostly treat it as an emergency device. In fact, I forget the very existence of it for days at a time.

Kryptos I understand that. I also use a prepaid SIM. But why swap them out instead of keeping using the the one you already have? It just makes you stand out like a sore thumb with IMEI whose IMSI changes on a regular basis, thereby attracting unwanted attention. Outside of accidentally misplacing your SIM card I can't think of any good reason to regularly put in a new one.

Kenny33

[deleted]

That makes sense. But I think if you’re outside of targeted surveillance and you use your phone regularly (not in airplane mode most of the time) then there may be benefits to swapping sim.

If I stick to a plan where the carrier has my identity, they can easily use my data from a mass surveillance perspective. If I swap prepaid sims every couple months, the three letter agencies may not have any issue targeting, but I doubt T-Mobile will figure it out.

[deleted]

Kenny33 the three letter agencies may not have any issue targeting, but I doubt T-Mobile will figure it out.

I was in fact talking about carriers not Three Letter Agencies. Each to their own, I guess. I'm here to learn how others use GOS.

Snowmonk

It's there a guide for activating eSim after installing GOS? I'm stuck.

I have gp sandbox installed, so the Fi app runs fine. Everything I want works pretty well, and now I'm ready to activate the 6a instead of my current 3a. But Fi app running on 6a complains that it can't activate.

Obviously Fi support is not going to be helpful... Where can I look for help?

MetropleX

Snowmonk perform the following sanity checks for me please:

Ensure that all 3 Sandboxed Play Services apps are installed: GSF, Play Services and Play Store by simply selecting the Play Store listing in the 'Apps' app in the app drawer and tapping install which takes care of the install of all 3 in the right order.
Install Fi after the above (meaning uninstall and reinstall it if done out of this order).
Open Phone and dial *#*#4636#*#* and tapping Phone Info and enabling DSDS.
Going to SETTINGS>NETWORK & INTERNET and selecting Enable privileged eSIM management.

Then try to activate eSIM in Fi.

https://grapheneos.org/usage#sandboxed-google-play-esim

MetropleX

rsm thankyou for this insightful and informative post. This type of assistance and commitment from users is what a great and helpful community is built on!

Aaron

I to have been trying to go "completely off grid". While I do nothing illegal nor have any intention to do so, I've taken the challenge to try and get Big Tech (and Big Bro) sealed out as much as possible.

Reality is that the best I have found is to pick a carrier that requires a government warrant to track my information.
Compare this to Google, Facebook, Amazon, Apple that are selling every speck of data they can on each of us both to the government, from Federal to Local, as well as advertisers. They will all provide VERY DETAILED location and DNS information on you to authorities WITHOUT A WARRANT.

While they claim "anonymous tracking", reality is an advertiser can tell where your phone spends the night, then look you up via public record, then literally map out your entire life (background checks) and behaviors. There are services that aggregate and present in easy to digest formats to anyone that wants to purchase the data.
Note that all VPN's, if handed a government warrant, will provide information on you.
So unless I'm missing something, best I can do is limit my behavioral information collection to my wireless carrier which still requires a warrant be issued in order to track me. For me that's good enough since that parking ticket in London from 20 years ago likely isn't going to draw Interpol, FBI and NSA effort to get a warrant. And keeps the Matrix from tracking me and selling me another Pixel 6. LOL

I'm new to this privacy game. Set me straight if I'm off. Always up to learn.

Kenny33

Aaron

I love the sentiment and very much have similar objectives to you.

One note, it does appear that a lot can be gathered without a warrant needed:

https://www.cbsnews.com/news/police-mass-surveillance-fog-reveal-tech-tool/
https://www.androidpolice.com/local-police-favorite-surveillance-tool-fog-reveal/

« Previous Page Next Page »