alex_herrero

I never tried Proton and cannot comment on this. But my own concern was that their Terms clearly say they can restrict/block access if using a VPN (except their VPN) which is a major issue for me as I am using Mullvad. So I never used Proton.

I have experience with Posteo and very happy with them so can recommend it to anyone.

      Volen But my own concern was that their Terms clearly say they can restrict/block access if using a VPN (except their VPN)

      Where do you see this in their Terms of Service? The version dated March 15, 2023, contains no such restriction. It only mentions "VPN" once as part of "Proton VPN" and there is no mention of "proxy", either.

      https://proton.me/legal/terms

      Using a VPN could trigger account actions due to point 7, but that is very much implied and not "clearly" stated.

      1. Having multiple free Accounts (e.g. creating bulk signups, creating and/or operating a large number of free Accounts for a single organization or individual);

        Volen Also, their Terms say they might block access to mailbox account if its accessed by VPN (except their own VPN) which is also a big issue for me as I am using Mullvad VPN: https://proton.me/support/compromised-account-temporarily-locked

        Ahh. I see what you're talking about now. This isn't in their Terms of Service. It's their security mechanisms locking out an account due to suspicious activity.

        The full statement is:

        It is also possible for our automated systems to lock you out of your account in error. This can happen if you use another VPN service (not Proton VPN), Tor, or if you are on the same network as someone who has been blocked by Proton for violating our terms and conditions (for example, if you use your work or college WiFi).

        They also state that you should be able to recover your account with your configured recovery contact information.

        Before logging in to your account, you may be asked to enter a code sent to your recovery email address or phone number

        None of this strikes me as particularly different from other major email providers and their protections against account compromise. It does indicate some level of tracking "normal" behavior or traffic for an account. So, perhaps your threat model is against this and that's okay.

        I think it's incorrect to claim that simple VPN usage is against their Terms of Service. A concern, yes, but not a clear violation.

            One issue with Posteo is that it only supports TOTP two factor authentication, not the more secure Universal 2nd Factor (U2F). To my knowledge neither does Proton, although I think it is planned. Tutanota does support U2F.

              Hi there. I went with some of the advice read here and installed Posteo on my Mac desktop, with the idea of using it in sync with my phone, which is running graphene OS. I didn't anticipate that I wouldn't find a Posteo 'app' for the phone. So now I'm having to use Vanadium to log into my new Posteo email. It isn't the end of the world but still an app would probably be better.
              Does anyone here use Posteo in GrapheneOS? and if so, do you use an app for it or just a browser?
              Thanks for your help!

                guser39

                Yeap, you are right - not Terms of Service, but the account locking article. As I never tried Proton, I can't comment on how often, if ever, this account lock happens - I was reading on the web that many people got their accounts locked this way though and it did push me back.

                Anyway, I am personally using Posteo and am very happy with them. Proton, Tutanota and Mailbox.org are also a solid choice - its a matter of personal experience and preference, really. At the end of the day we want something that respect user privacy and all these secure email providers seem to tick the right boxes.

                  Posteo is a solid choice.

                  Not sure if I'd recommend Proton, their privacy policy seems vague when it comes to how long they store the collected information.

                  Also, when they require an already existing email address during the signup process, they create a catch-22. They do allow using a disposable email address when signing up though.

                    nemo Also, when they require an already existing email address during the signup process, they create a catch-22. They do allow using a disposable email address when signing up though.

                    Interesting that they asked for an email address. I'll admit that it's been a while since I signed up. They did ask for a phone number for one of my accounts, if I remember correctly. I think I was connected using PIA at the time. For my oldest, I don't think it asked for anything.

                      I switched from Posteo to Protonmail 2-3 ago, and I have been quite happy since.

                      The reason I switched was mainly because Protonmail has many features that I missed from Posteo. And, at least in my experience, Posteo's spam filtering is really, really poor, and it became a real nuisance having spam daily delivered to my inbox. (Reporting these to Posteo's team did not seem to improve their spam filter). I do still pay for an account there, mainly to keep receiving email to the addresses I have registered there, but I have set up email forwarding to my Protonmail account. I logged in to Posteo today and immediately spotted a scam mail in the inbox. I then checked Protonmail, and it had correctly flagged the same email as spam.

                      Protonmail also supports custom domain names, which Posteo does not; although I respect their reasoning behind this.

                      When that is said, I do encourage exploring Posteo as an alternative to the other providers mentioned. If you find their web interface to be barebones, you can set it up with Thunderbird, K9, etc. etc. without issues. And their aliasing service is good. Protonmail can do basically unlimited aliasing as well, but you have to pay for their Unlimited plan, which is expensive if you only want their email service.

                      On the question of whether Protonmail is blocking Mullvad: Until a couple of weeks ago I used Mullvad with Protonmail for about 2-3 years. I have also logged in through Tor several times. I was never blocked nor did I have login issues, but then I have not been breaking their terms of service.

                      I have seen accounts on Reddit about Posteo also suspending accounts, and their support being unwilling to give a reply. I don't know how accurate these stories are. I have nothing but good experiences with Posteo customer support, but then I have never had my account there suspended.