Hi, I just have a question because I'm confused and the question came up when I randomly found a wikipedia article about Google Play Services. Maybe someone has some information about this.

Doesn't the inclusion of sandboxed play services (and play store) violate Google's ToS? The Wikipedia article says that you actually have to make a agreement with Google if you want to include these services. License fees are probably also necessary.

Unfortunately, I have not found any further information about that. The Google help pages are chaotic and I didn't find an answer to my question there. Thanks!

    Please note that these Terms of Service were carefully reviewed by GrapheneOS developers.

    GrapheneOS project does not break any Terms nor Conditions.

    GrapheneOS does not come with any Google Services pre-installed.

    Users can download and install Google Play services, Google Services Framework, and Google Play Store from the Apps app if they want to. These are the official apps with no modifications whatsoever. These apps were obtained from a regular Pixel phone running Stock OS.

      • [deleted]

      • Post #4
      • Edited

      xR23 I believe you're thinking of Google Mobile Services:

      While the Android Open Source Project (AOSP) provides common, device-level functionalities such as email and calling, GMS is not part of AOSP. GMS is only available through a license with Google and delivers a holistic set of popular apps and cloud-based services.

      Here's a contact form aimed at their would-be customers to give you an idea of who would normally be subject to such licensing.

      Hulk

      These apps were obtained from a regular Pixel phone running Stock OS.

      It doesn't go against their ToS or it's a fair game?

      • xR23 replied to this.

            Hulk
            So is licensing not necessary or has it already been licensed by GrapheneOS?

            [deleted] I believe you're thinking of Google Mobile Services:

            I'm not sure. Three parts are mentioned here

            • Google Services Framework (com.google.android.gsf)
            • Google Play services (com.google.android.gms)
            • Google Play Store (com.android.vending)

                  • [deleted]

                  • Post #7
                  • Edited

                  xR23 Some of your concerns are alleviated by one of the GOS developers here including how it works, where it puts Google and if this is an issue for GOS. It's a very good listen. Timestamp is included.

                  • xR23 replied to this.

                      Related question, enough to add here rather than new thread I think?

                      I have a P6 (bought used on eBay if it matters), and have GOS installed, but have not logged into google anywhere (and don't have a google account anywhere).

                      Technically, what is the basis of Google's TOS with me? I.e. with regard to the legality of them receiving any identifiable data about me?, especially in Europe with its data laws?

                      Does that change if I do use Sandboxed Play Services (but not logging in / setting up an account), especially if I e.g. use esim whereby they get IMEI.

                        • [deleted]

                        • Post #9
                        • Edited

                        Agrapheneuser These are just unmodified official releases of their apps that you're interfacing with. It should be no different than you using Google Search while being signed in (or signed out). It's all governed by the same ToS:

                        In the European Economic Area (EEA) and Switzerland, Google services are provided by, and you’re contracting with:

                        Google Ireland Limited
                        incorporated and operating under the laws of Ireland
                        (Registration number: 368047/VAT number: IE6388047V)

                        Gordon House, Barrow Street
                        Dublin 4
                        Ireland

                          Google is the hardware vendor of all "Pixel" devices, and they have a perfectly valid license with themselves to include those binary packages on their devices.

                          • xR23 replied to this.

                            [deleted]
                            Thanks for the link to the podcast. I'm not sure that I understood everything acoustically correctly, but the topic of my question is only briefly addressed once (At the point where it is about the cat and mouse game).

                            The question is whether a agreement with Google is necessary to use the Play Services. Who needs to make this agreement? GrapheneOS because there is the possibility to integrate these services? Do I have to make the agreement with Google?

                            I ask this because I bought a few things and need the Google account at the moment. Sometimes Google accounts are frozen without a understandable reason. Until you get your data back, it can take a long time and you have trouble with Google.

                            The Wikipedia article says that there must be a contract here (I know that Wikipedia is not a serious source, but that's why I ask here, because I have found nothing else). Is there a developer who knows this?

                            abcZ
                            Seems like a good point that permission only affects hardware manufacturers.

                                  xR23

                                  The question is whether a agreement with Google is necessary to use the Play Services. Who needs to make this agreement? GrapheneOS because there is the possibility to integrate these services? Do I have to make the agreement with Google?

                                  You the user agree to Google's ToS by using their apps and services. GrapheneOS doesn't integrate Play Services into the OS, it just allows you to install them, so it's not different from other apps in this regard.

                                  The Wikipedia article says that there must be a contract here (I know that Wikipedia is not a serious source, but that's why I ask here, because I have found nothing else). Is there a developer who knows this?

                                  To be clear I'm not a GrapheneOS developer, but for an OEM to ship GMS in their OS and use the Android trademark, they have to be licensed by Google. That's probably what you read. GrapheneOS does neither and so is not bound under the same terms as Android partners.