I'm confused about Google accounts

DjBeau

I just downloaded a game from Aurora and it wanted me to log into my Google account. At some point I must have logged into it because after digging around I found that I'm logged into Google Play services and Google Play store and in general my Google account. I didn't think I was because I have been using the Aurora store without logging in exclusively.

So, am I supposed to be logged in (is it all sandboxed?) or did I screw up somewhere along the way?

de0u

DjBeau The Android account system is designed so that once you sign in to any app from a vendor you are signed in to all of their apps. For example, signing in to Amazon's shopping app signs you in to their video app too.

This has nothing to do with "sandboxing", which does not mean "completely isolating".

pxlkng

DjBeau

Using Aurora Store is not recommended as it is dangerous and insecure, all while not providing any privacy benefit.

It is officially recommended to use the Play Store with sandboxed Play Services, which is more secure and more private. You can use it with an anonymous Google account if you like.

DjBeau

de0u
Ah, shit, I'm signed into Maps. That's why. Guess I'll have to create a burner account.

raccoondad

pxlkng "Using Aurora Store is not recommended as it is dangerous and insecure, all while not providing any privacy benefit."

TBF theres no real alterative to Aurora, assuming you wish to not install sandboxed play services & make a new account. It is better to use the play store, but not everyone has access to it.

pxlkng

raccoondad

There is no reason to avoid installing sandboxed Play Services.

Graphene1

pxlkng I understand why many don't want usage data being tied to a Google account

raccoondad

pxlkng I have to disagree, completely. I find it uncomfortable myself (I have bad experiences with Google services in general and want to avoid it outside of a independent profile)

n3t_admin

pxlkng There is no reason to avoid installing sandboxed Play Services

Mobile advertising ID? I've had instances of Play Services reenable it, after having deleted the MAID manually before. Since I never checked, I was running around for months with it (unknowningly) enabled. I assume you know about the possibilities of MAID tracking, especially for location.

GrapheneOS

Graphene1 Creating a new account or not creating one makes no tangible privacy difference since either way they have unique identifiers for the install. Every app can generate and store random numbers.

pxlkng

Graphene1

Even when using Aurora Store your usage can be linked together, this isn't any different that just using an anonymous Google account without any PII (no phone number, etc.)

DjBeau

GrapheneOS

Creating a new account or not creating one makes no tangible privacy difference

I'm a noob, but I think I'll disagree with that. Making a burner account seems a lot better than using my 15 years old Google account that has every single detail about my life for the past 15 years. But now I wonder if making a burner account even makes sense, since my old account has now been used on my Graphene phone. Wouldn't Google just "link" those two accounts since they've been on the same device?

Graphene1

GrapheneOS I assume you mean if you have Play Services installed using an account there's little to no privacy differences to not using an account? That seems logical.

Clearly, no Google account, no Play Services and using apps without google (and other data collection) libraries will have a fairly substantial privacy benefit.

pxlkng

raccoondad

There is nothing to agree or disagree on, here.

Play Services are always sandboxed and confined on GrapheneOS and have absolutely no special permissions or elevated access, they are just like any other app.
You don't need a profile to contain them, this doesn't change much.

raccoondad

pxlkng "There is nothing to agree or disagree on, here.", making your opinion objective makes you a lot less trustworthy, just saying...

"Play Services are always sandboxed and confined on GrapheneOS and have absolutely no special permissions or elevated access, they are just like any other app.", I did not claim otherwise, that's the idea of sandboxing, I still don't want it.

pxlkng

raccoondad

The fact that Play Services are sandboxed with no special privileges or access on GOS is not an opinion.

The fact that Aurora Store reduces security and therefore also privacy (as security is a prerequisite to privacy) and shouldn't be used isn't an opinion either, it is based on facts and recommendations by the GrapheneOS project.

Maybe I have worded myself poorly:
It is a valid goal to completely avoid Play Services.
But you are not doing that by using any apps that come from the Play Store or bundle Google libraries.
Aurora Store doesn't change this, at all. It only makes you less secure and private, but it doesn't stop any Google telemetry or tracking or data collection.

So there is no reason to prefer Aurora Store over sandboxed Google Play Services.

raccoondad

pxlkng

"The fact that Play Services are sandboxed with no special privileges or access on GOS is not an opinion.", I never claimed otherwise, you put words into my mouth.

"it is based on facts and recommendations by the GrapheneOS project.", I also never stated otherwise

If you want to pretend I said things I didn't, then its clear you are here to be bad faithed. I don't have time for this

pxlkng

raccoondad

I apologize that this came across this way. I was merely pointing out the issues with Aurora Store.

raccoondad

pxlkng Its fine, and with the issues you brought up, you are correct. Aurora lacks a lot (Play Store metadata verification, reduced CA set or pinning, trusting every webPKI CA, among other issues that akc3n mentions I won't pretend IK all of it).

I also wanted to mention, outside of sandboxed play, there isn't many safe alternatives and people are going to eventually have to make a decision based on their needs/paranoia. This is pretty much all I am saying

rambleon

I'm confused about recommendations in this thread. I do not have google play services installed on my phone nor do I have a google account. I use Aurora anonymously.

How does it increase my privacy if I create a google account, load play services, and log in to the account to download apps? That does not make any sense to me. Apps I use have never required a google account login.

pxlkng

rambleon

Specifically to the reason that Aurora Store has no privacy benefit:
Many Play Store apps bundle Google libraries with them, those run on your phone even without Play Services installed and allow Google to collect the same amount of data it would be able to collect with Play Services installed, which is not much to begin with due to everything being sandboxed and confined.

So Aurora Store doesn't avoid Google or Googles data collection in any way.

You can create an anonymous Google account not linked to you and without a phone number to use the official Play Store anonymously.

SgtSurehand

Something tells me without extensive support of Play services, Firebase and Google analytics those libraries are by far not as powerful as some claim them to be.

pxlkng

SgtSurehand

They collect the same amount of data.
Stop hoping it to be otherwise, come on the matrix channels or on Discord and ask this question and many other knowledgeable community members will say the same as me.

SgtSurehand

pxlkng my luck is only one app from northern light store uses network. So they get very little. I also browse with mostly JS off. At least I know my material. Play services can buzz off.