Press communication in France about GrapheneOS

Xtreix

NetRunner88 Turn off TV, do not read state supported newspapers, free your mind of all this 💩

Exactly, apart from a few pretty good reports that have nothing to do with technology, such as arts, animals, and food (even if we don't need TV for that), TV and state supported newspaper are largely a means of lobotomizing yourself while wasting your time, left or right, no matter. It lost its appeal a long time ago and is mainly watched and reading by boomers, for the TV, even they admit that it has become a poor medium for watching movies, so they all have Netflix subscriptions. Disney+ etc which are poor quality and invasive streaming services that I personnaly don't use and will never use.

The other problem is that social media as a whole is no better and influences the media.

Eirikr70

Xtreix Lol, I'm almost a boomer, so let me read my newspaper ;)

M_2_Sade

Eirikr70 we figured :)

mmmm

NetRunner88 That’s all well and good, but it’s not us here that need to be told or to understand. It’s the general public. And as they’re fully unaware of most of that, then your rant does nothing to make Graphene’s standing any better to these people that don’t understand..

grayway2

GrapheneOS Are you talking about Johanna Brousse ?

She's not the leadership of French law enforcement but rather the leader of a task unit in charge of cybercrime.

She said " Mais ça ne nous empêchera pas de poursuivre les éditeurs, si des liens sont découverts avec une organisation criminelle et qu’ils ne coopèrent pas avec la justice."

In English: if it's proved that the GrapheneOS foundation has connections with the organized crime and refuse to cooperate with French justice, we'll sue them.

mmmm

grayway2 In English: if it's proved that the GrapheneOS foundation has connections with the organized crime and refuse to cooperate with French justice, we'll sue them.

What makes me rage about the type of statement is that it's so uneducated. Way to say you know nothing without saying you know nothing. Apple devices can be made just as bullet proof against LE, I bet they won't even threaten to sue them though. Muppets.

grayway2

mmmm Remember the dispute between the FBI and Apple after the San Bernardino attack. The FBI repeatedly asked Apple to implement a backdoor in iOS encryption and opened a court case to force Apple to create and electronically sign new software that would enable the FBI to unlock the iPhone 5C (unlimited attempts to brute force the passcode)

mmmm

The news on the telly in france tonight is dutifully reenforcing that people are being killed by drug gangs and they're using grapheneOS. Cue crying mothers, and suspensful music. These same kids, of course, are being killed by cops pretty regularly.

mmmm

grayway2 I do remember that. But this is different. This is turning the publics opinion. So if the mother in law I mentioned earlier happened to realise I was using grapheneos, would she feel obliged to 'turn me in' or would she inherently distrust me the same as she would if she found a gram of coke in my pocket?

grayway2

mmmm As for now, GrapheneOS isn't illegal to use.

French authorities are really pissed off that they can't extract data on Pixels with GrapheneOS and I have a strong feeling that they're trying to destroy or make disappear the entire project.

They're currently creating a bad opinion of GrapheneOS so they can later have an excuse when they'll declare it illegal to use (publishing a lot of articles about how much grapheneOS helped drug dealers, terrorists or child molester to commit horrible crimes until the public believe it was exclusively built for them and that GrapheneOS is an evil thing)

argante

GrapheneOS THO did an episode about these publications in France. He's pointing out that the press is trying to link you to criminals, and your response on Twitter can only help them. THO being ridiculed by some, but he's a big promoter of the GOS. I suggest you seek legal help. Maybe @ryrona can advise you, as seems to have considerable experience in this area. In my opinion, the Graphene Foundation should consider suing these newspapers for defamation, demonstrating that attempts to link the GOS to criminals could influence the foundation's donors. This is your best defense to prevent the GOS from being criminalized.

ryrona

argante Maybe @ryrona can advise you, as seems to have considerable experience in this area.

Oh no, don't involve me in this. Honestly, France will not take any legal actions against GrapheneOS if GrapheneOS is not based in French jurisdiction, since their actions against GrapheneOS would be illegal pretty much anywhere else in the world, so they would not get support for it from other countries. French government has a history of illegalizing things though, and then doing a country wide DNS/IP-ban of all services related to that thing. We in the activism area I am active in has already been victims of that years ago. So as I see it, that is the worst outcome here. They would block grapheneos.org domain and related IP-addresses in France. Also known to be super easy to circumvent using VPN services, as they don't block VPNs. And such blocks tend to in average case lead to 2/3rd of users dropping out, 1/3 circumventing the ban. With that said, France has not illegalized GrapheneOS yet, and I am uncertain how such a law would be phrased to not risk illegalizing stock Android devices and iPhones too. But we will see.

Eirikr70

grayway2 I disagree with that. How would they apply that rule ? They couldn't control all the Pixels, or make the Pixels illegal. I don't think they would go that path. But they make so having a Pixel becomes suspect.

grayway2

https://www.franceinfo.fr/faits-divers/narcotrafic-les-autorites-alertent-sur-l-utilisation-d-un-systeme-d-exploitation-de-telephone-pour-echapper-aux-forces-de-l-ordre_7631510.html

Le système Graphene OS permet notamment l'effacement automatique des données du téléphone en cas de manipulation par un tiers (notamment lors du branchement sur un ordinateur), d'installer des applications piégées qui provoquent l'effacement des données en cas d'activation (en reproduisant par exemple un fausse icône du mode avion ou d'une application comme Telegram ou Snapchat), souligne le document des renseignements criminels

(everything listed can be achieved in a basic android device, it's not specific to GrapheneOS)

Les autorités judiciaires tentent désormais de recenser le nombre de téléphones avec cette configuration utilisés par les trafiquants de drogue, selon la magistrate.

(Today, it's the drug dealers, tomorrow every French citizen who use GrapheneOS ?)

Xtreix

Folks, let's stay united and cool with each other.

M_2_Sade

NetRunner88
I suggest you take a look into the field of historiography, you might quickly discover that the cyclic reading of history comes from theology (from Zoroastrianism and other old beliefs) and has not rationalistic ground...

Eirikr70

If ever GrapheneOS gets into legal problems in France, I am willing to testify that an average Joe uses it for other purpose than selling drugs or preparing a coup d'Etat.

DeletedUser499

Eirikr70
Governments are not interested in Truth and testimonies. They are shit scared of GrapheneOS and want it demonised etc...all bets are off in the way they will try.

grayway2

Eirikr70 They don't care if you're a criminal or not. They want to be capable to access EVERY grapheneOS Pixel during a physical extraction.

They can't brute-force a six-digit PIN thanks to the Google Titan M2 and they can't either retrieve the decryption keys in AFU.

Even when the stockOS was vulnerable to AFU extraction, GrapheneOS wasn't.

The default USB-C port blocking when the device is locked is far more secure than what did Google on stockOS.

GrapheneOS can become illegal to use in France.

They might block grapheneos.org
Force Google to sell new Pixels in France with non unlockable bootloader
Put you immediately in jail for the maximum extent of what the law permit in case of refusal to hand over the decryption key(s) of your GrapheneOS Pixel to law enforcement

It's even possible that they will put under surveillance every citizen who'll use GrapheneOS

23Sha-ger

grayway2 Force Google to sell new Pixels in France with non unlockable bootloader

Daily trips to Spain, Italy, Germany, Belgium, Switzerland would be on the rise :)

argante

ryrona Oh no, don't involve me in this.

I've been impressed by your comments for a long time. You certainly have experience in these topics.

ryrona France will not take any legal actions against GrapheneOS if GrapheneOS is not based in French jurisdiction, since their actions against GrapheneOS would be illegal pretty much anywhere else in the world

Pavel Durov case? Did he send child pornography? No. Was he a human trafficking criminal? No. Telegram was just a platform, but Durov was accused of others using the platform for illegal purposes.

Maketrades

I have been wondering how the most of the people are surprised of this actions from the French.. A couple weeks ago it was Spain and Holland a bit before it was sweden Norway and the uk. I saw ryrona saying the below..

ryrona Honestly, France will not take any legal actions against GrapheneOS if GrapheneOS is not based in French jurisdiction, since their actions against GrapheneOS would be illegal pretty much anywhere else in the world, so they would not get support for it from other countries.

I have this to say..

The ones who follow a bit what is happening in courts all over the world especially in holland germany and usa regarding the hacks of encrochat and sky ecc know its obvious that what they did is illigal and that its full of proven lies.. They are in this together and back eachother for the cause.. The information they got out of there illegal actions has provided them with so many insight of the crimes what resulted in many 10-15-20 years of punishments that i am sure that they will do everything in there power to get access of the conversations of the criminals again legally or illegal..

What this has to do with the GOS project is that its a fact that most of the serious criminals use GOS for there conversations on different e2e chats programs so because of that GOS is a serious target to attack..

Based on the above I have a question regarding the functionality of the servers.. How big or how small is the chance that they be able to attack the servers of GOS to add or to modify something to add on a update pushed from the server like they did in the case of encrochat? Or any other way by adding a key logger or what ever they could think of.

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