Riseup mail

router99

If it blocks TOR, that's a red flag.

raccoondad

router99 riseup and proton are very well known and trusted, but they don't allow sign ups, you need to know someone with another rise up account and get a code from them. Proton is just plain weird.

I actually know someone with a rise up account, might sign up with them tbh

ryrona

Wilflower You can sign up with Proton using a throw-away email provider. As long as the throw-away email provider guards sufficiently against spambots, Proton tend to not block those addresses for verification.

Invite codes are rarely handed out on request like that. If you want to use RiseUp, you have to look up through which ways you are expected to get the invite code. Do you need to send an email to the admin explaining why you want or should have a RiseUp account? Or do you need to know someone personally already using RiseUp that can vouch for you? RiseUp at least used to only be for left wing activists, not for general public.

router99

raccoondad Explain your problem with Proton a little better, please. It seems you have a bone to pick with them ("just weird").

yiit

Wilflower

Proton and riseup email has had serious leaks and if you plan to use them in any sort of high privacy or high threat model, I would not use them. They are not trustworthy with regards to an extreme privacy or high threat model standpoint. Tuta may be the only option, though that option only works if you are communicating with another tuta user. But even then, email is unsecure and it is better to use other secure messaging platforms.

ryrona

yiit Yeah, the problem is one need an email to be able to sign up for other more secure messaging systems.

Dumdum

yiit Proton ... has had serious leaks

Evidence?

yiit

ryrona

I realize that. I'm just providing this so you can make an educated decision based on the information provided. Only you can determine your threat level.

yiit

Dumdum

https://www.securityweek.com/protonmail-accused-voluntarily-helping-police-spy-users/

https://www.cyberlaw.eu.org/2021/09/protonmail-shared-activists-ip-with-law.html?m=1

https://restoreprivacy.com/protonmail-data-requests-user-logs/

Take your pick. A quick search will show you.

Probably9857

Dumdum yiit Proton ... has had serious leaks

Evidence?

The important thing is to realize exactly what Proton does and doesn't encrypt. While Proton is pretty open about that, many people who just see "encrypted email" and don't do any further research would probably be surprised.

Furthermore, Proton has always said they will cooperate with valid requests from LE in their jurisdiction. Then it comes down to what information they are able to provide, and what they simply don't have.

yiit

Dumdum

https://riseup.net/en/about-us/press/canary-statement

I am providing this as well since you probably want this too. It is even on their webpage.

yiit

Dumdum @router99

Since you guys both want this:

https://digdeeper.club/articles/email.xhtml#protonmail

Dumdum

yiit
A company or organisation complying with law is not a leak though. And I will (sadly yet again) point out that the activist also could have used a VPN, so the """leak""" is merely one of their own making.

yiit

Probably9857

Well with regards to their email, they began logging the IP of a user. Meaning they actively were monitoring them.

Dumdum

Probably9857
Except I wouldn't regard any of that to be a "leak". So evidence of actual leaks would be appreciated if accusations of such are made.

Probably9857

yiit they began logging the IP of a user. Meaning they actively were monitoring them.

Proton actually has a feature to do this, so you can see if anyone else has been logging in to your account, but presumably in the case of a request from LE they would do it secretly and without user consent.

The thing is, anyone with a serious threat model should understand that a website you visit will be able to see your IP address if you don't use a VPN or Tor.

LE knows this, and so they ask Proton to provide it. Proton can't just refuse a legally valid request when they obviously have access to the data requested.

yiit

Probably9857

I know that. Hence why my entire OP specified "extreme privacy and high threat model." All my post was meant to do was provide information for a basis to make an informed decision. I recommended not using email for "extreme privacy and high threat model" needs and even stated email being insecure. Idk how much more clear I can make my statement.

Dumdum

yiit
Didn't ask and don't care about Riseup, but ok.

Probably9857

yiit Idk how much more clear I can make my statement.

My issue was only with your use of the word "leaks".

I don't think it is accurate to describe it as a leak when it is just the service doing what they have always said they will do.

A leak is an unexpected or accidental disclosure. This is just a policy.

Sabotagetrick17

I can recommend mailbox.org. German provider, server location also in Germany. The entire mailbox can be encrypted with a public PGP key. This makes fast checking your mails impossible but increases your privacy. Decryption then takes place on your device and not on the provider's site.

If this is not convenient enough for you, you can also upload your private PGP key so that encryption and decryption is possible via the web front end. Of course, you should trust the provider in order to use this feature.

yiit

Sabotagetrick17

I considered them as well, however if you need email to communicate with friends and family, it won't be secure if they don't use a secure service as well. Having only your side be secure doesn't help with friends and family on insecure services. Bottom line is email is not a secure form of communication except in very specific situations like two tuta users. It depends on your needs as to whether email is worth it and where you are ok with giving up some privacy or security.

yiit

router99

Lol, you are making an assumption I have a bone to pick. Look at the evidence I provided. If you don't like it I can't help you.

raccoondad

router99 I can't speak on their infrastructure, I just remember it being annoying to make an account w/ them, similar to riseup. Most likely to prevent abuse/spam

faxe

yiit digdeeper is not a reliable source, make sure to verify their claims elsewhere

Rizzler

Riseup is a political club, not a public mail service.

yiit

router99

Here

https://cyberscoop.com/protonmail-swiss-court-ip-france/#:~:text=Technology-,ProtonMail%20said%20Swiss%20court%20order%20left%20no%20choice%20but%20to,up%20from%2017%20in%202017.