Buying from carrier. Any difference

DeletedUser443

I'm buying a pixel 9 pro xl and I would just like to know if there is any difference in buying from a carrier vs a non carrier store?
When I say that, I mean both come in unopened boxes and both are UNlocked so just wanted to know if:

Is there is any difference firstly (bloatware/carrier stuff - remembering both are unlocked)?
If there was carrier bloatware on it from carrier purchase, would it even matter or would all bloatware be removed anyway when graphene is installed rendering no difference where purchased from?

Asking as carrier has a currently discounted price but I don't want to buy there if it comes with any disadvantage.

Appreciated!

Dumdum

DeletedUser443
https://grapheneos.org/install/web#prerequisites

To make sure that the device can be unlocked to install GrapheneOS, avoid carrier variants of the devices. Carrier variants of Pixels use the same stock OS and firmware with a non-zero carrier id flashed onto the persist partition in the factory. The carrier id activates carrier-specific configuration in the stock OS including disabling carrier and bootloader unlocking. The carrier may be able to remotely disable this, but their support staff may not be aware and they probably won't do it. Get a carrier agnostic device to avoid the risk and potential hassle. If you CAN figure out a way to unlock a carrier device, it isn't a problem as GrapheneOS can just ignore the carrier id and the hardware is the same.

As long as your particular device can be unlocked and installed with GOS:

would all bloatware be removed anyway when graphene is installed rendering no difference where purchased from?

Yes.

de0u

DeletedUser443 I'm buying a pixel 9 pro xl and I would just like to know if there is any difference in buying from a carrier vs a non carrier store? When I say that, I mean both come in unopened boxes and both are UNlocked [...]

The box being sealed doesn't matter. Whether the device will or won't OEM unlock is based on an entry in a database inside Google that the stock OS will consult after each "factory reset".

There are two kinds of "unlocked", "carrier unlocked" aka "SIM unlocked" -- not sufficient for installing GrapheneOS -- and "OEM unlockable" aka "factory unlocked". Most employees of most carriers can't tell the difference. As an important example, these days most Verizon devices are carrier-unlocked but can never be OEM-unlocked.

DeletedUser443

de0u

de0u is there a way I can know for sure prior to buying?
If not, is there somewhere I can purchase from that definitely can load graphene?

I'd hate to get one and not be able to.load

de0u

DeletedUser443 Is there somewhere I can purchase from that definitely can load graphene?

Buying an "unlocked" Pixel from the Google Store is the surest way (and also probably provides the simplest warranty coverage, if that becomes necessary). After that, the details depend on which country the purchase is made in. For example, in some countries it is illegal to sell locked devices.

DeletedUser443

The reason why I asked that way is the stores that sell them here, even if not a carrier store technically are actually dealers for specific carriers so I think the stock may come from the carriers anyway. I'll have to do some research. Please comment if you have any suggestions though.

DeletedUser443

de0u Are all the pixels on the google store unlocked in all countries that you know of? The main reason I ask is the fact that I can see them for sale in the google store but I can't see the words unlocked. I assume they are "unlocked" and compatible but I'd hate to get one that can't load graphene. Appreciate all your thoughts

n3t_admin

DeletedUser443 Are all the pixels on the google store unlocked in all countries that you know of

yes

de0u

DeletedUser443 Are all the pixels on the google store unlocked in all countries that you know of?

What I see now for the 9a in the U.S. is Unlocked, Google Fi, AT&T, and Verizon.

Note that when Google says "unlocked" they mean "really actually unlocked all the way", which is the same thing that many eBay vendors mean by "factory unlocked", which is not the same as what many people mean by "unlocked", which is "carrier unlocked" / "SIM unlocked".

You might get better answers by indicating which country you're in, since "all countries" answers probably don't exist for this issue.

DeletedUser443

de0u in Australia so would be buying from Google store /Au

Pixel 9 pro

Was also interested if anybody here knows if the pixels they sell in carrier or retail stores in person here are fully unlocked as they do seem to have better deals than the Google store so that would be preferred if anybody knows

DeletedUser443

de0u since I'm new to this, a question I have is does it matter how you pay for it when you purchase it? Like do carriers or google keep a record of who got what hardware serial etc and if so, does that reset anyway when you load another os on it or would it stay since serial is same regardless
I know I'm just over the top for absolutely no reason lol but worth the ask.
I just really love learning stuff even if not required

Once again appreciate the comments and info. Everyone has been so helpful!

Blastoidea

DeletedUser443
There are no “deals”.

It only looks as if there is.

de0u

DeletedUser443 Do carriers or google keep a record of who got what hardware serial etc and if so, does that reset anyway when you load another os on it or would it stay since serial is same regardless

If you buy from Google's online store the device serial number will be associated with your account, which is useful if the device needs warranty service.

If the cellular modem is on then one or more carriers will receive the IMEI of the device as it registers with the network.

Loading a new OS does not change the device serial number or the IMEI.

DeletedUser443

de0u as above my question was more about being privacy focused when purchasing. Not so much about warranty records but point taken

DeletedUser443

Appreciated. I guess my question was more asking if i am going to the point of more privacy and security then is it better to buy it from a non google account or at a physical store with cash or even card. Or does this really not matter. I may not be understanding it well (getting there slowly) but it just seems that if it was bought from the Google store with a Google account with my card or paypal then it would be traceable and non private the whole way through even with the new os loaded which would PARTLY thwart the purpose of the private os? Whereas if bought by cash or even card at a physical store then it would be more private? Tell me if I'm wrong though. I'm happy to learn.

de0u

DeletedUser443 Privacy isn't a knob with "less" at one end and "more" at the other end. It's important to think carefully about what you want to conceal from whom.

If you use a VPN, your ISP doesn't know which sites you're visiting, but your VPN provider does.

Buying a Pixel with XMR from a stranger in a bar probably means Google doesn't know you own that Pixel... unless you install Google Play and Google Maps and plan routes from your home to your work, in which case maybe you'd have been better off buying from the Google store and getting convenient warranty service.

More privacy, after you decide what you want to conceal from whom, probably requires sustained behavioral changes, as opposed to doing a few extra one-time steps when getting a new device. Installing a screen protector can be a "one and done" operation, but there isn't a corresponding "privacy protector" step.

Probably9857

DeletedUser443 Whereas if bought by cash or even card at a physical store then it would be more private?

Of course that would be more private.

DeletedUser443 which would PARTLY thwart the purpose of the private os?

GrapheneOS is what it is. It doesn't have a purpose.

The real question is, "What is your purpose in using it?" Who do you want privacy from? Why? What costs (monetary & inconvenience) are you willing to bear to achieve your desired level of privacy? There are no one-size-fits-all solutions, only various tradeoffs.

DeletedUser443

Appreciate both replies. Points taken.
My case is really just privacy in general from big tech and invasive unnecessary data collection. It is so invasive and wrong and hasn't sat well with me for years.
Also the constant data breaches
Being forced fed certain companies apps on devices that you can't even disable or uninstall etc also doesn't sit well with me

I've always been a huge believer in an individuals right to privacy. Unfortunately most large companies (and individuals) don't seem to share my thoughts it seems whereas this project OS does seem to share most of my values. I have already told a few people of Graphene and I will be donating as I feel there is so much work that goes into this and should be appreciated.

I realise I am transferring my trust from one to the other

The things I have done for as long as i can remember but feel are insufficient with mainstream OS now are:
Only a couple of reputable necessary apps on my device (eg vpn, secure email service, banking app)
Withdrawn permissions as much as allowed from each app (this is something that has annoyed me for a long time where apps don't let you withdraw permissions that are not actually needed but yet they stop you withdrawing those permissions which points to data collection) (also i withdraw permissions or restrict background data use or battery and a few hours later i find some apps have turned itself back on again)
Use of VPN
Use of secure email service
Use of adblockers
Use of privacy focused browser (although im sure vanadium will be better)
Never had location turned on
Have never used maps or gps (maps and all google apps that can be disabled are disabled)
Never use Bluetooth or similar

I think that is about it but since so many apps can't be tamed with regards to permissions or can't be deleted, im looking for the next level of privacy which i feel graphene will be fit for my needs

P.s. I'm happy for you to tell me if there is something above that stands out that I could be doing better too or if my thoughts are incorrect

de0u

DeletedUser443 My case is really just privacy in general from big tech and invasive unnecessary data collection. It is so invasive and wrong and hasn't sat well with me for years.

Fair enough!

But it's not clear to me what is at risk if Google associates your name and your billing address with the device serial number, if they're not getting other data from or about the device.

Meanwhile, if you have a regular cellular subscription and carry a phone around all day, a big company is collecting a lot of data about you (likely associated with your name and billing address).

DeletedUser443

de0u you make a fair point
There is probably no risk to me with regards to that. Maybe it was overkill on my part

I really appreciate your responses

Out of curiosity, is there anything in my list that you would say could be done better or differently as I'm always learning?

Also, genuinely, besides general location via cell location (even accurate location) and obviously any call / text data which I know is very insecure which is rare for me anyway, what kind/is the lot of data that telco would be getting you mention in your comment?

Im always willing to learn or modify my habits if required but I don't really see this data i mention above very important compared to what the stock os and apps shares or can potentially share (but I could be totally missing the picture too which is why i ask you)

de0u

DeletedUser443 Also, genuinely, besides general location via cell location (even accurate location) and obviously any call / text data which I know is very insecure which is rare for me anyway, what kind/is the lot of data that telco would be getting you mention in your comment?

With standard usage, a cellular carrier knows where you live, where you work, how often you visit casinos and bars, when you sleep, and who you sleep with. And if a VPN is not in use the carrier knows which web sites you visit when (maybe it's OnlyFans...maybe while you're at work?).

DeletedUser443

P.s. I don't know if this changes response overall but I could possibly be thinking of running a sandboxed google play services unless I can run the couple of apps I have without it

de0u

DeletedUser443 I could possibly be thinking of running a sandboxed google play services unless I can run the couple of apps I have without it.

If Play and those apps are in a secondary user profile which is placed at rest when those apps are not in use that would cut down on whatever they might collect.