Coding level of GrapheneOS developers

DeletedUser459

How long does it take for one person, with almost no knowledge at coding, to fully understand developing a secure operating system, and actually contribute to the actual development? I think I saw GrapheneOS uses various and complex languages like Java and Rust.

de0u

DeletedUser459 It is possible to contribute code if you know only one of the key languages. Also, it is possible to contribute without being a coder at all, by getting a second device, setting it to the alpha-release channel, and joining the testing chat room.

(A second device is not a requirement for testing, but it may be a good idea if one depends on one's primary device to work 100% of the time.)

ErnestThornhill

DeletedUser459 All of what the project is looking for in a developer can be found here:

https://grapheneos.org/hiring

raccoondad

DeletedUser459 to fully understand developing a secure operating system, and actually contribute to the actual development?

You can't, this isn't how that works...Java is not a 'complex' language, neither is Rust. they are just languages....

Unless you have educational background, such as a degree or similar, you cannot contribute to the codebase directly to GOS.

If you had a background in software enginering, you would already know how to contribute to the GOS codebase...

Please consider rather joining the alpha testing channels and using a spare device to do user-end testing of GOS and report issues in said channel.

TranceSeven

It's going to depend a lot on the intelligence / talent of the person. I've worked with people who have been coding for 40 years and I wouldn't want them near anything remotely to do with security. Equally, I've seen some very clever coders in their 20s who just seem to understand everything thrown at them.

DeletedUser459

TranceSeven Is security/hacking another aspect beside the ability to code?

Byteang3l

de0u would a 7a be a good device? If I wanted to buy one and install graphene just to help out?

Dumdum

Byteang3l
The best ones would be 8th generations and above. Devices below that don't have memory tagging (MTE) so you wouldn't be able to test Graphene with full capabilities. But if you already have/can get a 7th generation device, then I suppose it would still be helpful for testing issues that might be unique to those devices.

de0u

Byteang3l Please note that I don't speak for the GrapheneOS project. That said...

On the one hand, the 7a has 2.75 years of support left, which is a lot less than other devices.

On the other hand, I get that 7a's are cheaper than 8a's, and there are lots of things that can be usefully tested on any supported device: various popular apps; notifications; lock screen display; incoming calls; outgoing calls; eSIM installation; Bluetooth calls; Bluetooth-connected smart watches; Wi-Fi calling; Android Auto (including calls); adjusting system font sizes; checking that the supported system languages still work.

Edit: switching between user profiles; installing apps in Private Space; ... many things are device-independent.

TranceSeven

DeletedUser459 Yes. The ability to write code is one thing. Knowledge of the subject is something else, and equally as important. I spent a long time as a developer before I ever had to write code dealing with databases (for example).
Knowledge of security is "just" another aspect of that. Knowing why doing something one way and not another is a good/bad thing has repercussions.
Hacking is another skill. Knowing how to break something can help to write it better in the first place.
However, we're getting out of my skill set too, so I can't personally guide you much beyond these generic statements.

lackofhumor

raccoondad
I do not agree one bit.

raccoondad You can't, this isn't how that works...Java is not a 'complex' language, neither is Rust. they are just languages....

First of all, there are languages, and there are languages.
I hope I don't have to make a full argument on why, I will just say that you cannot do the same things with Prolog and Scala, and I hope that this statement is enough to understand that evey language has its own objective, structure and complexity.

raccoondad Unless you have educational background, such as a degree or similar, you cannot contribute to the codebase directly to GOS.

Secondly, in our company I met people with a degree and years of experience that couldn't code properly and young developers that learnt in their basement who were better at coding because they simply put an effort to make it the right way.

raccoondad Please consider rather joining the alpha testing channels and using a spare device to do user-end testing of GOS and report issues in said channel.

At last, while I agree that helping with the alpha testing is a good idea, I honestly do not understand why you are killing DeletedUser459's interest.

He asked what would it take to learn coding (in terms of time) and didn't put any limit on how.
Maybe they was planning to go to university and wanted to know if he needed 3 years or five, we don't know it.

Honestly I think people could/should have a more helpful approach.
It's our duty to take care of our community.