Genode and other Microkernels

Bernardin

Even though Google has reassured the community that AOSP is not going away, perhaps it's prudent to explore alternative open-source operating systems to mitigate potential future risks or dependencie?

The only ones with good enough security that I know of are these:
https://genode.org/
https://ironclad-os.org/
https://github.com/Atmosphere-NX/Atmosphere

These microkernels show promise, but none are ready for real world usage yet.

argante

Bernardin I would look at Redox OS.

SamuraiCrow

L4Linux is a Linux user-mode wrapper for one of the microkernels that Genode supports. (Genode is an API wrapper for multiple kernels rather than a microkernel implementation.) The L4Re microkernel is the specific one used by it. Since Genode supports all L4 series microkernels, it should be on-topic to note that existing Android drivers are incompatible with microkernel designs in general and would need driver rewrites to allow them to run in user-mode rather than supervisor mode and that the Linux wrapper linked above only supplies user-mode Linux APIs needed to run apps. I suspect it removes the supervisor-mode code from Linux and replaces it with function calls to the microkernel. Genode should be able to run side-by-side with Android and Linux apps but would probably interface directly with the microkernel and its drivers.

brookie229

I know virtually zip about all this but what about BB10? Microkernel but 32 bit so a big no I guess?

SamuraiCrow

brookie229
Correct. All modern phones are 64 bit ARM. The BB10 would be a non-starter.

brookie229

SamuraiCrow

Is it a monumental task to reform it to 64bit?

SamuraiCrow

brookie229
Yes. Especially since there are others already ported to 64-bit ARM.

Bernardin

https://asterinas.github.io/2025/06/04/kernel-memory-safety-mission-accomplished.html

SamuraiCrow

Bernardin The Rust-based Framekernel looks very interesting! Presently, it is only compiled on x86-64 and RISC-V but it is planned to be ported to ARM64.