Desired features in a GOS phone

matchboxbananasynergy

DeletedUser313 actually I wonder why companies like Samsung don't get the problem since their OS are forks too technically

Because they are Android partners and are therefore blessed by Google.

JollyRancher

DeletedUser313
I would pay $3000 for a properly secure (open source, audited, secure supply chain) GOS phone with p9p features and the (relatively modest) needed app upgrades.

If it existed, I would buy one tomorrow.

If GOS implemented a good MDM system paired with that phone so that secure (against the device owner) work profiles are viable (along with per profile SIM selection) then they would become our standard corporate phones basically the next day.

The reason that corporate America and governmental agencies overwhelmingly chose iPhones isn't out of some abiding love for Apple. It's because they have the desired feature set and are reasonably secure.

Without MDM, GOS simply isn't even in the conversation for the vast majority of corporate environments.

But offer a good, FOSS, MDM implementation built right into GOS on secure, feature competitive, hardware and suddenly that becomes a very strong contender for corporate deployment. Especially in the medical, legal, finance, and NatSec fields. A high (relatively speaking) upfront cost for the hardware is basically a non issue in that environment.

But to be competitive in that market you need a feature rich, essentially flagship, experience. And if you aren't competitive in that market then realistically you aren't going to move the volume of phones needed for a financially viable product.

basedFOSS

JollyRancher Governmental funding could be an option as well.

On the path of the EU becoming independent from authoritarian leaders, the EU mobilizes more money towards open source.

Moving the organisation to Europe (on paper) is not a prime option but to be considered as a brain storming option

DeletedUser313

basedFOSS But the EU doesn't seem to like private phones

https://old.reddit.com/r/europe/comments/1kvmguc/eu_is_planning_a_new_mass_surveillance_law_that/

JollyRancher

basedFOSS
The EU hates real electronic privacy and security. They are substantially worse than the US in that front.

You aren't going to get the EU to fund or support an actually secure publicly available smartphone. They might purchase and use one that was on the market but they aren't going to actively aid one.

basedFOSS

JollyRancher D

DeletedUser313 This is due to the endeavour of multiple members but also many members strongly work against such surveillance.

So luckily in terms of legislation, there isn't "The EU". The composition of the organs changes with elections in the member countries.
=> A valid arguments against my idea would be the resulting uncertainty of funding depending on current politics.

basedFOSS

basedFOSS How about cooperation with universities?

Projects for "future technologies" easily get millions of funding over several years.
Also the GOS team could gain connections to hardware engineers offloading cost into scientific research projects and most importantly directly train and shape new student developers

Just another idea, open for criticism

areaman

Honestly I just want everything on the KXCD Phone 6

cuckflared

My ideas:

ability to connect the phone to TV/monitor using an USB-C cable
base-band-free option to be 100% sure that the device never connects to the cellular network. With the airplane-mode you have to trust e.g. that the modem doesn't ping the tower from time to time.
a separate Graphene-powered router device that would act as an internet gateway for the base-band-free phone

Having a separate router allows you to take your base-band-free phone with you while leaving the router at home and thus avoiding cellular tracking. If you otherwise switched off the base-band on the phone before leaving home it would be visible in the logs.

Of course there are already mobile routers on the market but they do not provide physical security. By having a Graphene router with a screen lock and fingerprint reader we could ensure that an attacker cannot change e.g. VPN configuration. Such a device could have much less RAM and slower processor, no mic, no speakers, no camera, to lower the cost.

basedFOSS

cuckflared I really like the idea of maximum privacy by design

...However when it comes down to people needing such measurements for their personal safety, then it would be better to go by security by obscurity from an outer first perspective.

What I mean by that is that for journalists, activists etc it is better to not appear suspicious at the first place and prevent further searching and forensics because that could lead to more or less "advanced" interrogation methods in the increasing amount of authoritarian countries.

Therefore a casual phone that many people use would be preferable for those people. Put some normie data on and hide & secure sensitive data.

cuckflared

One more useful thing:

privacy screen protector

DeletedUser313

cuckflared Is it possible to just buy a generic privacy protector of the same size for an optical scanner? I can't find any for my phone

Crazy8

The ability to change the IMEI and other data that can be used to fingerprint the phone

cuckflared

Crazy8 Changing IMEI is not enough, this issue has already been described by GrapheneOS developers:
https://grapheneos.social/@GrapheneOS/113319956422621755

DeletedUser299

The ability to run from a micro SD card, like tails on a laptop etc.

cuckflared

DeletedUser313 Sorry, I don't know.

user539

No cameras. Physical switch for microphone, sensors, network. A real secure and privacy phone

DeletedUser370

user539 No cameras.

Somehow I suspect that a lot of GrapheneOS users use and desire a built-in camera. Personally I would like to have the occasional video chat over Signal, and to have a way to scan QR codes, such as to set up attestation with Auditor. If a GrapheneOS device is to be targeted only towards people who want no camera, I suspect that fewer people would buy it; perhaps significantly fewer.

For people who worry about a potential zero-day exploit able to bypass the camera permission, covering the camera with tape or a sticker will have the same effect as having no camera. The only benefit I can see of not having a camera at all would be to make the phone cheaper; again, perhaps at the cost of sales.

gwr

I think it would need to be made to last so I agrees with some of OP's specs.

For cost reasons, however :

1TB is unnecessary, Have 256Gb, perhaps 512.
Micro-sd card slot of 1TB.

I also personally would like a second USB-C port. I know it might not be the prettiest but as Android becomes acceptable for Desktop, this could be necessary. (Imagine having to do a data transfer from your camera or another hard drive, your usb-c slot is already taken as you use it for display and peripherals. A second usb-c will be perfect).

A screen with a custom, always changing refreshing rate. I believe CCTV cameras (or any cameras for that matter) is calibrated at a certain standard refresh rate. That's why when you try to film screens sometimes it would be garbage. I believe that the GraPhone would be able with a custom display to have small changes in refresh rates that will be unnoticeable to user but counter CCTV spying on phones (and PINs).

It would be pretty cool if it had a switch for the SIM tray.

DeletedUser313

If GrapheneOS made its own phones, would many countries be able to ban it from being sold in their own territories? Since it's a phone designed for security (and actually delivers, unlike iPhones), I don't think many governments will be happy about it. Most Pixel users are ordinary people with relatively insecure phones but it feels as though a GOS phone would be targeted. GOS doesn't have the power of Google either so it would be much easier to deal with. It would be a niche phone that few buy so there wouldn't be much protesting

ryrona

DeletedUser313 If GrapheneOS made its own phones, would many countries be able to ban it from being sold in their own territories? Since it's a phone designed for security (and actually delivers, unlike iPhones), I don't think many governments will be happy about it.

Countries could hypothetically ban anything. Light bulbs and one-time use plastic bags are illegal to sell in my country. That is why everyone has fancy LED lights here, and bring their own bags to the grocery store. More on topic, it is illegal to bundle phone chargers with a phone when selling a phone. That is why I charge my phone with my laptop, I didn't get a charger with my phone. All this is motivated by reducing power consumption and waste.

But I have never heard of any phone, tablet or laptop being banned because of being security or privacy focused or sold to security and privacy enthusiasts only. At least not where I live, and I guess it is the same in most countries. Phones, tablets and laptops that constitute a danger to the user, such as likely to have exploding batteries or do not stay within regulations for electromagnetic emissions may not be sold. Plus, there is a fair chance an actual secure and private phone like a GOS phone would be interesting to companies too. They generally only buy the most secure and private phones on the market to their employees anyway, to protect company secrets.

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