Certain iphones now can limit cell towers' ability to triangulate your device.

pizzadequeso

https://support.apple.com/en-us/126101

Is this something GOS can do on software level?

Murcielago

Apple's article remains vague about how exactly this will be implemented:

With the limit precise location setting, you can limit some information that cellular networks may use to determine your location.
[...]
The limit precise location setting enhances your location privacy by reducing the precision of location data available to cellular networks.
[...]
With this setting turned on, some information made available to cellular networks is limited. As a result, they might be able to determine only a less precise location...

source: https://support.apple.com/en-us/126101

It also seems to work with just a handful of carriers (would be interesting to know why).

Therefore, your question is probably difficult to answer in terms of how and if this could be implemented until further information is given.

Depending on threat model and cell size of the tower a device being connected to (which the feature doesn't seem to obfuscate), I suspect one's definition of "precise location" may differ from Apple's.

Titan_M2

It's likely some firmware specific stuff that Apple can do with their in-house modem.

pizzadequeso

Titan_M2
I think you are correct. These 3 apple devices have their in house C modems.

This should be a standard feature on the upcoming GOS OEM phone.

N1b

pizzadequeso This should be a standard feature on the upcoming GOS OEM phone.

It might be

DeletedUser622

Sounds like snakeoil. How is it possible the network doesn't know exactle where a connected device is?

Airplane mode is the only way to avoid the cellular network tracking your device and works correctly on the devices we support.
https://grapheneos.org/faq#cellular-tracking

dawt

My guess is that the LTE/5G standards contain ways for cell towers to request location information from phones (eg. signal strength from neighboring cells), which could be used to triangulate you with greater accuracy. Enabling this option disables this so cell towers have less information. You still have to be connected to a cell tower, so obviously the cell network will still know roughly where you are.

DeletedUser622

Read the article

they might be able to determine only a less precise location — for example, the neighborhood where your device is located, rather than a more precise location (such as a street address).

gristle-cause

I'd need to see detailed technical documentation before putting any stock on this. It's not immediately clear how you'd limit triangulation without degrading cell service.

This could be some novel networking technique, a poorly a explained feature, misinformation, privacy theater, or something else entirely. No way to know before Apple discloses better documentation

Blastoidea

I would like to know how this works.

They give out no useful information whatsoever.

BeepBeep

Interesting. Wondering whether they utilize a sort of gain randomization -- simulating different distances from different towers by altering transmitter strengths to each.

MotherShipton

Wait til the governments around the world ban this feature...... "for the children"

mercury

"The limit precise location setting doesn't impact the precision of the location data that is shared with emergency responders during an emergency call."
https://support.apple.com/en-us/126101

That tells me Apple know exactly where you are at all times, when connected to a network, but they are just choosing not to share it with some telecom providers.

typical big tech double talk....

xxx

mercury typical big tech double talk....

Sad but true! We just shouldn't trust them.

Blastoidea

I find it hard to believe that carriers get their location information from Apple etc.

Does someone have a reference?

AcclaimSublevel19

Blastoidea that's not what's being mentioned. When a phone connects to a cell network, the carrier can triangulate your location based on your distance to base stations (probably based on signal strength). I don't know much about cell network technologies, but perhaps the specifications also include some commands to request the device location.

The modems on some newer iPhones (Apple's C series of chips) can reportedly reduce the accuracy of those measurements to some extent, although the community has no evidence of this and the extent it can do so is unknown. Since cell networks need to know your approximate location (which cell you're in) to properly route calls to you, this can't do much to protect your privacy, especially in densely populated areas.

andrej567

Interesting is in the description from apple that it works only with a few providers. As if the cellphone would not send some mandatory data, it would be kicked out from the tower (with other providers). No idea how this works.

Blastoidea

AcclaimSublevel19

Thank you.

Interesting idea, I guess.

horde

https://an.dywa.ng/carrier-gnss.html related

de0u

horde Great link. Thanks!

xxx

horde
Ouch! I did not know.

andrej567

horde Very interesting
I am wondering about 2 things (not expecting answer)

from the text: So the network simply asks “tell me your GPS coordinates if you know them”

What if the cellphone would pretend it does not know its coordinates (for example power saving is on)

or differently, who feeds the cellular modem the data about the precise position? is it the operating system,
or the cellular modem+gps receiver is one module and they communicate without needing the OS to pass the data between them?

third stupid - suppose you have patched this and return to cell provider wrong data, that are accidentaly matching crime location.. that would be bad.

DeletedUser622

horde Does GrapheneOS protects from RRLP and LPP requests?

blissartt

could be a firmware thing, could be a deal with carriers.
i hope it can be implemented elsewhere, too