The "Ask Every Time" permission doesn't actually ask every time

monozygote

For eg. I have allowed Signal to access Camera and microphone but under "Ask Every Time" instead of "Allowed all the time". When I use Signal, it pops up the standard permission request options listing "Allow while using the app", "Allow only this time" and "Don't Allow/Deny" (not sure if these are the exact words but should be close enough).

I select "Allow only this time" and things work fine. However if after sometime I use signal again for a video call, none of this happens, it just starts with full access to camera and microphone.

I don't know how long after, but if I haven't been using signal then maybe in the next day or two it'll ask all that again.

Is this normal? When I choose "Ask every time" and then when it asks if I choose "Allow only this time", I would expect the next run of the app to ask this again. But since that's not happening, I'm guessing it's some sort of timer-based? If so isn't this unexpected that neither "Ask every time" and "Allow only this time" don't seem to do what they are saying?

other8026

monozygote I have heard that it's a timed thing. This comment says about one minute: https://github.com/GrapheneOS/os-issue-tracker/issues/5132#issuecomment-2746319351

monozygote

other8026 Cheers! Oh I can definitely confirm it's nowhere that short. It lasts for hours at the very least. In my experience it's only the following day that I get the pop up again.

1 min would be really good, but unfortunately it's way longer than that.

userofgos

monozygote After grsnting the permission one time do you by chance continue to use the phone without locking it, and/or opening the signal app multiple times throughout the time on your device without locking it, and/or without closing the app via app switcher?

I use "Ask every time" for camera permission on WhatsApp and find that I only get the permission popup dialogue after locking my device, then on next unlock and relaunch of WhatsApp the pop up appears again. Or say I close WhatsApp via app switcher, then open it again, I receive the permission pop up again.

monozygote

userofgos

continue to use the phone without locking it, and/or opening the signal app multiple times throughout the time on your device without locking it

No, for instance it's been at-least 5 hrs since I wrote my last message. I had used signal then. After that I didn't touch my phone, it screen-locks in _1min. By locking I'm assuming it's the normal screen-lock and can be unlocked with biometrics. If you mean ending the session instead, then no, I don't end the profile session.

and/or without closing the app via app switcher

No I always switch all apps off and never leave any app hanging about.

Having said that, I use Signal without play services so it's granted permission to run in the background and battery optimisation is off/unrestricted.

However I'v whatsapp in my private space, and that too suffers the same problem. I just tested it and it doesn't ask for the camera/mircrophone permission even after a few mins once I've granted them ("Always Ask" and "Allow only this time" etc). In-fact I locked and unlocked (with biometrics) the private space and it still doesn't re-ask for the permissions. I'm assuming any kind of locking of the pvt-space immediately kills all apps in it. If so then whatsapp should def. have been killed.

I'm on P8Pro btw if it helps. I'm wondering if there's a global timeout setting for this feature or something that I need to set. If not then no clue why are these permissions being "remembered" and only after an entire day of not using, it asks again (or so it seems).

userofgos

monozygote I just tested on WhatsApp. If I open the app the first time, go to take photo in the chat, I get the pop up and click "Only this time", the camera works as it should. Then if I immediately close WhatsApp app from the app switcher, lock screen, or both and then reopen WhatsApp it still has the permission granted. However, the permission resets around 2 minutes and I get the pop-up again. All this was in the Owner profile. Same also applies for me with Instagram in private space.

monozygote

userofgos Hmm so I did some more testing. So...

I long-pressed Signal -> App-Info -> Force Stop -> wait for ₂ mins (phone/screen-lock is irrelevant - I can continue doing other things) -> come back to signal -> start video call -> re-asks for all the permissions as expected.
I checked with the stock GOS camera app. Changed permissions to ask-every-time + allow-only-once (from the subsequent popup) and if I reopen camera app after ₂ mins (no force-stop or anything) it re-asks as expected.

So phone-locking etc are irrelevant. Camera app is behaving as expected. Signal only re-asks after a day or more of non-usage. Otherwise I'm having to force kill it in order to make it behave like say the Camera app.

This is weird. Is an app which is allowed to run in the background (battery-optimization set to "unrestricted") gets the permission attached seemingly permanently by design, even though I'm not actively using it? I would expect the OS would take the permissions away after not using the app (well that's why we also have "Allow when using the app" permission if we want to opt-in) irrespective of anything else, but that's not happening.

This is all in secondary profiles btw (in-case it matters), not the owner profile.

I no longer have whatsapp to test anymore but could you try giving your whatsapp the permission to run in the background with battery-optimization -> unrestricted and see if the behaviour changes @userofgos ? Thanks!

userofgos

monozygote that is weird. I'm not sure what the issue is with the signal app as I use Molly.

I did what you suggested and tested WhatsApp with unrestricted battery usage. Clicked send a photo in the chat, got the required popup, selected "Only This Time", switched to other tasks and came back 5 minutes later to repeat and I still got the subsequent permission popup

ThisOldGuy

userofgos
The Molly devs are active in their matrix chat, and another active here I think @Nuttso. Maybe they can shed some light?

I experience the sane thing on Molly. I don't have signal or WhatsApp.

userofgos

ThisOldGuy yeah I have this issue with Molly as well.

monozygote

Cheers all! Just for clarification ( @ThisOldGuy , @userofgos ) are you all saying you get the unexpected behaviour with Molly or Molly behaves like you would expect?

I experience the sane thing on Molly

Just wondering did you make a typo and wanted to say "same thing" as in the permission lingers unexpectedly or did you mean "sane" as in it's behaving as expected (ie the perms get taken away after a few mins of non-usage) ?

I also now tired it with Catima (wallet app) and that also behaves as expected. It asks for camera permission again after a few mins of non-usage. Signal is the only one behaving weirdly just now.

Also for the sake of completeness, I switched signal back to "optimized" (ie removed the unrestricted battery usage) and it's still behaving like it previously was. So it's not something to do with battery optimization.

Kinda bit concerning as to why it's keeping a hold of camera and microphone resources if that's the case. Or if my signal app is somehow tampered if no one else is having this issue on signal - interesting as I'm not an interesting "target" for most, so I don't think that would be the case + it's app-verifier verified (had installed it from GitHub via Obtanium initially).

userofgos

monozygote are you all saying you get the unexpected behaviour with Molly or Molly behaves like you would expect?

Sorry for the confusion. To clarify, I'm experiencing this unexpected behaviour. I believe it might have to do with one or both of the persistent notifications.

Websocket Service: Ready to receive messages
Molly is unlocked: Touch to open.

However I've had conflicting results. Here are the steps to reproduce on a Pixel 8a running GOS 2025071900, Molly installed and setup with Device Encryption:

The First Instance: When I open Molly for the first time and select the camera icon to take a photo, I see a purple button in the middle of the screen that says "Allow access".

I tap the button and it works as expected and shows the access permission dialogue.
Next after I get the permission dialogue asking for camera access, I tap "Only this time"
Camera permission is granted, and can now take a photo (when camera permission is unblocked from Quick Access).
Then I swipe up and spend the next three minutes multitasking, opening other apps until I check again if the Molly is still granted the permission. Sure enough, when I click the camera icon, it's still working, I see what the camera sees and can take a photo with no request to allow access again.

The Second Instance: When I open Molly for the first time and select the camera icon to take a photo, I see a purple button in the middle of the screen that says "Allow access".

I tap the button and it works as expected and shows the access permission dialogue.
Next after I get the permission dialogue asking for camera access, I tap "Only this time"
Camera permission is granted, and can now take a photo (when camera permission is unblocked from Quick Access).
Then I swipe up, press the power button to lock screen, the spend the next three minutes waiting with the device locked. By this time, Molly has cleared the unencrypted data from RAM -- this is a process that can be observed by swiping from top of screen and expanded the "Secure wipe in progress" notification.
I preceed to open Molly and check if the permission still granted the permission by clicking on the camera icon and the good news is, the screen is back to black with the purple button that says "Allow access" and when I tap on it I get the permission dialogue.

ThisOldGuy

userofgos @monozygote
Confirming ditto on first instance. Not second because I do not auto lock molly when I lock my device.
Molly does not behave as expected with camera access "only this time" permission.