New to Graphene OS – A Few Questions

roynacc

Hi everyone,

I am new to Graphene OS and have been reading a lot about its privacy and security features which is why I decided to give it a try. However I have a few beginner questions and would love some guidance:

App Compatibility: How well do regular Android apps run on Graphene OS. Are there any specific apps that might not work or require extra steps to install.

Google Services: I know Google services are not built in but can I still use apps like Gmail, Maps or YouTube without sacrificing too much privacy.

Backup Solutions: What are some good privacy focused backup solutions you all recommend.

Daily Usage Tips: Any advice for someone transitioning from regular Android to Graphene OS.

I am excited to learn more from this community and hear about your experiences.
I also searched this topic on this site https://discuss.grapheneos.org/d/3153-new-to-grapheneos-with-a-few-questions sap-sac but I could not found anything helpful.

Thanks in advance for the help. 😊

Best,

Eirikr70

roynacc Hi @roynacc and welcome,
1- App compatibility is excellent and only a few apps don't run with GrapheneOS, mainly (a few) banking or identification apps. You can give a look at that page.
2- Some apps declare they need Google Play but don't or just for notifications, some really do need it. You can choose to install it or not. You can use whatever apps you like most. Sure, using the most mainstream apps is a loss of privacy but still, using them with GrapheneOS reduces your exposure. You might decide later to switch to other options ... or not.
3- There is for now no perfect backup solution at the level of your phone. GrapheneOS is shipped with Seedvault, which suffers some imperfections. The dev team is working on a replacement but there is no estimated time of achievement. Anyway most apps propose their own backup.
4- As for daily usage, I recommend that at the start you change nothing to the way you use your phone. Use the same apps, the same way ... Some people (I have been one of them) want to achieve a radical switch regarding privacy and compromise convenience. The best way (for me) is to have a soft switch and experiment slowly.
And have fun !

Phead

Eirikr70 You can give a look at that page.

You posted literally seconds before me. That's the link I was looking for. Thanks, mate!

Phead

Hi and welcome!

You may have already done that but a first stop to get answers to your questions is the project's website: https://grapheneos.org/features#grapheneos and https://grapheneos.org/usage#sandboxed-google-play

For the most part you can use your GrapheneOS device just like any other Android device but with the extra cherry on top that you are 100% in control of your data and privacy. But I would suggest that you search the forums for specific apps you are planning to use and see wheather there are any known issues. Some banking apps refuse to work as far as I remember. There is a website with a list of compatible banking apps but I cannot seem to find it. Maybe someone else can provide it.

You can still use Google services without compromising your device thanks to the incredible effort of the GrapheneOS team.

When it comes to day-to-day tasks it might be easier to ask specific questions - it's easier to get helpful answers. But since you've already made the decision to switch to GrapheneOS I would suggest you start by replacing your Google apps with privacy respecting services. The Proton suite is a solid start.

I personally prefer offline services above anything else - I generally don't like autosync (ok, Standard Notes is actually cool). Maybe you can replace some of your old habbits with offline solutions (password management, 2FA, note taking stuff, ...).

If you have any questions feel free to ask here in the forums or in the Matrix rooms. The community is very competent, civilized and friendly so don't be afraid of asking "stupid" questions.

missing-root

The first reply is really good.

I encourage you to install the "F-Droid Basic" app and search for apps there. Also have a look at known 3rd party repositories

There you find 99% friendly, small, efficient apps that do one thing and do it well. Also some crazy cool and complex apps like OSMAnd~, Gadgetbridge etc.

It is not easy to find privacy friendly apps on Google Play, it is full with cheap fakes or copied apps, all are full of ads, pay-to-get-basic-features etc.

There might be apps on Google Play that contain ads and trackers, while looking the same as an app on F-Droid.

Instead of F-Droid you can use Obtainium, but this has pros and cons (not reproducible builds, uncontrolled build environments, full trust in developers, ...). Just using F-Droid is fine, really. And not invasive at all.

other8026

There are many issues with F-Droid. Please take a look at https://privsec.dev/posts/android/f-droid-security-issues/.

missing-root It is not easy to find privacy friendly apps on Google Play

This isn't really true. Many apps that are on F-Droid are also on Google Play.

missing-root There might be apps on Google Play that contain ads and trackers

If people don't want ads or trackers, they can choose to install open source apps that are known to not have ads or trackers.

missing-root Instead of F-Droid you can use Obtainium, but this has pros and cons (not reproducible builds, uncontrolled build environments, full trust in developers, ...).

Other apps can have reproducible builds and not be on F-Droid. For example, Molly does this https://github.com/mollyim/mollyim-android/blob/main/reproducible-builds/README.md

Also, the developers are the ones who write the apps. We already have to trust the code they wrote. I don't understand why we can trust their code but we can't trust them to build an app.

[deleted]

other8026 true, many apps from F-Droid (and by origin Github, GitLab, Codeberd etc.) are also on Play Store but
1.) they are not identical versions
2.) Play Store doesn't provide controls to search for this type of apps so they are literally lost in the myriad of other apps that you are not necesaarily curious to see. You can overcome this by searching for apps in Aurora Store and eventually download them with Play Store.

other8026

[deleted] they are not identical versions

Sometimes they are, sometimes they aren't. It's up to the developer.

The main issue I have with what was initially said is that it could be interpreted to mean that all apps on Google Play have tracking and ads built in. That's not the case.

[deleted]

other8026 and for that reason we need a measure that allows us to search for ones that don't

missing-root

other8026

No of course not, that was also not really written.

Many apps are not on the Playstore at all
There are many cases of faked apps, in the name of FOSS apps
Google doesnt care for FOSS in the store, which doesnt help
Some apps from the same devs include ads etc. in the playstore variant but not in the FOSS variant
The playstore requires devs to upload their signing key, which sounds insecure and like an arbitrary way to do MITM attacks. VLC has issues with this for example.
The Playstore may have random restrictions, causing cases like the one with that XMPP client (Conversations?) that read the contacts, optionally, and was banned for that.

Also, yeah Molly might have reproducible builds but not most of them. They might include nonfree dependencies that are not in the code.

F-Droid does a check before they are accepted to the repo, which givee some trust. They have a feature to list antifeatures transparently.

It is simply another instance possibly having an eye on those apps.

I use Obtainium myself, but together with a store for proprierary apps, and "F-Droid Basic" for searching, including in repos. The experience here is really bad using Obtainium alone, and the Playstore has the issues listed above.

Eirikr70

Anyway, I'm not quite sure that this discussion has its place in the present thread. OP has asked whether she could still use Gmail, Maps or YouTube, so one can infer that getting trackless apps is not her main concern as for now. She will make her own way about using GrapheneOS, participate to this forum and discover. Leave her time to make her own choices !...

AlphaElwedritsch

Every thread, but really every one, degenerates into a bashing between fdroid and other stores. Aren't you getting fed up with this yourself?

It's funny at first, but over time it just gets ridiculous and annoying...